Offline awaken_D_M_golem
Epic Member
****
Posts: 7024
(un-) Amazingly Unproductive
Respect: +68
View Profile
[Archive] ... Gygax's Guitar Heroes
« Topic Start: September 19, 2015, 02:39:55 PM »
Nother from the 2nd-gleemax-pocalypse
and following Nifft's lead on [Archive]
AlterFrom did this, circa May '09.
Gygax's Guitar Heroes!
IMAGE(
http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/guitar_hero.jpg)
Pic Unrelated, but hilarious.
Flip to the last chapter of Arcane Power, the rituals one. This is where the fun starts. We already know about Duplicate and then Fool's Gold; any magic that lets you create "gold" is certain to be broken at some point or another. These two just let you fake wealth, however. BUT! What if I told you there was a ritual that generated real, cold, hard cash?
Flip to page 154, if you please. Top-right corner. Call of Friendship ritual.
It costs 50 gp to cast, and needs a 50 gp focus. A Diplo check of 19 or lower gets a 1 hour friend and 5 gp; 20-29 gets you an hour and 25 gp. 30-39 gets you 6 hours and 50 gp - Hey! We break even with a check of 30+! But wait, it gets better! A check of 40+ gets you 24 hours and 500 gp.
A Net Gain with a check of 40+. The question is, then, just how early can this happen?
It can happen at Level 1 3, since I forgot to account for the "level -2" restriction on the target. (With a few caveats or a bit of cheese)
The math for the trick is currently set for level 1 since it will take me a few minutes to recalculate at a +1 bonus to the check.
The Setup
Hide
We're gonna have a full party here, 6 characters, as follows: (all are level 3)
Half-Elven Bard of Waterdeep* (Takes "Skill Focus(Diplo)")
Half-Elven Ranger (Takes the "Crucial Advice" encounter utility power, Also takes "Skill Training(Diplo)")
[Any Race] Cleric of Waukeen (Takes the "Waukeen's Silver Tongue" CD power)
[Any Race] Cleric of Garl Glittergold (Takes the "Glittergold's Gambit" CD power)
2 Characters of any race and any class. (Must have Diplomacy as a class skill)
All members have training in diplomacy and a 10 CHA (The Bard has a 20 CHA). They have diplomacy mods of +6.
*Or any background that grants +2 diplomacy, per the PHB2 background rules.
The "Heist"
Hide
Let's break it down step by step:
The party pools their starting gold, for a total of 600 gp
A scroll of CoF costs 215 gp, the focus costs 50 gp, the components cost 50. The party can afford 2 scrolls, 2 castings worth of components, and a focus with 20 gp leftover.
The Bard has a total Diplomacy modifier pre-mods of +18 (1 Level + 5 CHA + 5 Training + 3 Focus + 2 Race(Untyped) + 2 Background)
Another Half-Elf in the party grants a +1 racial bonus to Diplomacy to the Bard and the other party members (the Bard covers the other Half-Elf party member) putting the others at +7 diplo.
The Bard's Words of Friendship power grants a +5 bonus to the Diplo roll. (Admittedly the most untenable part of the combo since you might not be able to use the minor action at the proper time, but...it makes the trick a good bit smoother with it)
The Bard's Clockwork Precision power (AP p8) bumps the party members' diplo AA checks to +9 (auto-success) and cause them to provide +3 per check rather than +2. Since it lasts until the end of the encounter, activating it just before starting to cast a scroll leaves the allies just enough time to use it. Otherwise, a second bard in the party could simply use it instead of the main Bard.
The Clerics each provide a reroll to the diplomacy check, and the ranger does so as well.
Per PHB p179 and p299, we can have up to 4 allies assist with the skill check for a total +12 (A +9 bonus on the allies guarantees they'll get the DC 10 to aid)
We're up to a total bonus of +31 with 3 rerolls and 2 castings. Math time!
With a +36, we're guaranteed to not lost the value of the components at least. The probability of increasing our wealth is as follows:
DC 40 - 36 = Success on 4+ = .15 chance of failure.
.15 ^ 3 = .003375 chance of failure after rerolls. = .996625 chance of success after rerolls.
.00375 ^ 2 = 0.000011390625 chance of failing both castings.
.996625 * 500 gp = 498.3125 expected gp per casting
At a cost of 265 gp for a scroll and components for each casting, we can expect an income of ~233 gp per casting.
At 1 casting every 10 minutes (5 minute cast for being a scroll and a 5 minute rest, assuming purchase time is negligible), this is 30672 gp every 24 hours since we don't need to ever take an extended rest.
At this rate, we could purchase a L30 magic item in 102 days (A bit over 3 months).
Surely it can be done more elegantly, though?
Indeed it can.
Ocean's Eleven Style (AKA the super-special-awesome version)
Hide
The party is composed as before, but now everyone is level 4.
Their feats are as follows:
Bard: No necessary new feats.
Clerics: Multi to Wizard, Take a familiar feat.
Ranger: As Clerics
Others: As Clerics
Other new things:
Bard Can now cast CoF once per day for free, having scribed it into his spellbook.
Bard now has a Gem of Colloquy L2, granting another +1 to Diplo
All party members and their familiars now aid the bard, for a total AA bonus of +30 (10 assistants: 5 allies, 5 familiars; The allies use APs to produce the necessary action for the familiars to AA the bard, who didn't take a familiar because I felt the bard APing during the ritual was really pushing it.) (Explanation of why I disregarded the 4 ally "limit" on AA in next spoiler)
The Bard's Diplo check is now at +63, plenty more than enough to hit the DC 40 check every time before rerolls.
Since the Bard can cast the ritual for free 1/day, the trick now requires 265 gp of startup money for a focus and scribing fee for the ritual. It's considerably slower than before, but it's now 100% guaranteed to grow infinitely and costs 0 upkeep money.
On Aid Another
Hide
For Reference:
PHB p179 wrote:
Cooperation
In some situations, you and your allies can work
together to use a skill; your allies can help you make
a skill check by making a check themselves. Each
ally who gets a result of 10 or higher gives you a +2
bonus to your check. Up to four allies can help you,
for a maximum bonus of +8. If you have a choice, let
the character in your group who has the highest base
skill check bonus take the lead, while the other char*
acters cooperate to give bonuses to the check. See “Aid
Another,” page 287, for how to cooperate in combat.
PHB p287 wrote:
Aid Another
You use your action to aid another character. You can
aid an ally’s attack roll against one enemy or grant an
ally a bonus against an enemy’s next attack. You can
also use this action to aid someone else’s skill check or
ability check.
? Attack Roll: Choose a target within your melee
reach and make a melee basic attack vs. AC 10. If
you succeed, deal no damage, but choose one ally.
That ally gets a +2 bonus to his or her next attack
roll against the target or to all defenses against the
target’s next attack. This bonus ends if not used by
the end of your next turn.
? Skill or Ability Check: You can instead aid a skill
check or an ability check made by an adjacent ally.
Make a DC 10 skill check or ability check. If you suc*
ceed, you give a +2 bonus to your ally’s next check
using the same skill or ability. This bonus ends if not
used by the end of the ally’s next turn.
The usual ritual cooperation rules call for using the "cooperation" rules on p179. However, the CoF ritual calls for a skill check after the ritual is cast, meaning the allies can activate Aid Another on round 100 (since it takes 10 mins to cast) and do the same with their familiars with an action point.
If we work by RAI here (which, IMO, was thrown out the window the moment this became an infinite wealth trick), the earliest perfect success is guaranteed is level 16. The math proving this claim is trivial and thus left to the reader.
This trick is perfectly legal in LFR, but the level item restrictions make it rather pointless (can't use items over 4 level higher than you).
This trick is perfectly useful in homegames, but the lack of rules-robot DMs make it rather pointless (any of a myriad of reasons).
Big Thanks to:
Ieniemienie for starting the ball rolling.
-and-
awaken_DM_golem for helping me nail out the details.
Original Thread on BG
Credit for First Conception to:
Stardock, here
Logged
avatar#3 , gravitational lensing edition ... I'm way on the other side of the universe but look like pretty rings
Offline awaken_D_M_golem
Epic Member
****
Posts: 7024
(un-) Amazingly Unproductive
Respect: +68
View Profile
Re: [Archive] ... Gygax's Guitar Heroes
« Reply #1: September 19, 2015, 04:11:15 PM »
totally separate
4e Metaknowledge:
The fun thing about perusing the wizards site,
is occasionally you stumble on something outrageous !!
From this page:
{broke link}wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4dnd/...
{original adress - broke link too}
http://dnd.wizards.com/go/article.aspx?x=dnd/4dnd/playingevilraces... and check out the level 3 magic item.
I want one of those.
It is kinda expensive though, unless those gold pieces are really small.
